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	<title>Comments on: Bree &amp; #RWAfail: A Lukewarm Tale of Mutual Antipathy</title>
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	<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016</link>
	<description>Where things go bump &#38; grind in the night.</description>
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		<title>By: Karin</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2404</link>
		<dc:creator>Karin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jun 2009 01:31:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2404</guid>
		<description>Bree, I just have to say that your post put a smile on my face. Very well said.  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bree, I just have to say that your post put a smile on my face. Very well said.  <img src='http://moirarogers.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Bree</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2365</link>
		<dc:creator>Bree</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 13:32:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2365</guid>
		<description>@Lee

&lt;i&gt;I’ll be the first to admit that I could probably make more money working a 40-hour job in an office somewhere, but my publisher and my book, Ransom, earned enough to qualify for RWA’s published status in the first year or so after my book was published.&lt;/i&gt;

Just to be clear, I in no way meant to imply that everyone makes less than $100 on their books.  Obviously I don&#039;t find that to be the case. But I have books that made less than $100 over the course of 3 or 4 months and I, personally, find that to be an unacceptable return on effort  most of the time.  (Not always, though--in one case I wrote a story knowing I might not see more than $25 but I did it for a specific reason, knowing it up front, and enjoyed writing it enough to not care.) However, I recognize that other people may not share my focus on money, and I don&#039;t think that makes them any less valid. To each their own.

I don&#039;t think epublishing does itself many favors when epublished authors refuse to admit the downsides of the business.  Not in the eyes of people trying to discredit it, and not for themselves.  If there was one thing I would love to see more than anything, it&#039;s more open and honest transparency.  It&#039;s hard to communicate information about sales and money and difficulties had with a publisher without coming off as unprofessional and tacky, and with this business as small as it is, no one wants to be That Author.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Lee</p>
<p><i>I’ll be the first to admit that I could probably make more money working a 40-hour job in an office somewhere, but my publisher and my book, Ransom, earned enough to qualify for RWA’s published status in the first year or so after my book was published.</i></p>
<p>Just to be clear, I in no way meant to imply that everyone makes less than $100 on their books.  Obviously I don&#8217;t find that to be the case. But I have books that made less than $100 over the course of 3 or 4 months and I, personally, find that to be an unacceptable return on effort  most of the time.  (Not always, though&#8211;in one case I wrote a story knowing I might not see more than $25 but I did it for a specific reason, knowing it up front, and enjoyed writing it enough to not care.) However, I recognize that other people may not share my focus on money, and I don&#8217;t think that makes them any less valid. To each their own.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think epublishing does itself many favors when epublished authors refuse to admit the downsides of the business.  Not in the eyes of people trying to discredit it, and not for themselves.  If there was one thing I would love to see more than anything, it&#8217;s more open and honest transparency.  It&#8217;s hard to communicate information about sales and money and difficulties had with a publisher without coming off as unprofessional and tacky, and with this business as small as it is, no one wants to be That Author.</p>
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		<title>By: joyroett</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2363</link>
		<dc:creator>joyroett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 08:07:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2363</guid>
		<description>Authors are so awesome when they rant. Very well said!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Authors are so awesome when they rant. Very well said!</p>
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		<title>By: Heather Brewer</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2361</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather Brewer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 05:01:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2361</guid>
		<description>I think the RWA needs to wake up and realize that more and more people are turning to ebooks.

I am not a writer but am an avid reader.  I love anything that is slightest bit paranormal and am pleased at the amount of books available today but often I order ebooks from Ellora&#039;s Cave, Samhain or other ebook publishers.  I can get a couple of books for what you normally spend on mass market paprbacks.  I have an ereader that I love so it&#039;s very convenient for me.

While I still love the feel of a book in my hand (especially relaxing in the tub or around the pool) my ereader is so much easier to take on vacation because I am not loaded down with books.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the RWA needs to wake up and realize that more and more people are turning to ebooks.</p>
<p>I am not a writer but am an avid reader.  I love anything that is slightest bit paranormal and am pleased at the amount of books available today but often I order ebooks from Ellora&#8217;s Cave, Samhain or other ebook publishers.  I can get a couple of books for what you normally spend on mass market paprbacks.  I have an ereader that I love so it&#8217;s very convenient for me.</p>
<p>While I still love the feel of a book in my hand (especially relaxing in the tub or around the pool) my ereader is so much easier to take on vacation because I am not loaded down with books.</p>
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		<title>By: Lee Rowan</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2360</link>
		<dc:creator>Lee Rowan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 04:37:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2360</guid>
		<description>Antipathy is a good word--and a perfect description.

&quot;only the author can decide if the dream of being published is sufficient reward to offset the fact that their royalties never break 2 digits. &quot;

I&#039;ll be the first to admit that I could probably make more money working a 40-hour job in an office somewhere, but my publisher and my book, Ransom, earned enough to qualify for RWA&#039;s published status in the first year or so after my book was published.  

That was before RWA changed the rules to exclude POD.  And I don&#039;t think it&#039;s a coincidence that the mass-production rule was put into effect immediately after some E-book publishers of GAY romance (mine among them) qualified for Professional status.

My being e-published led to a contract with Running Press for a mass-produced romance novel.  No agent or RWA involved.  I&#039;m really curious to see how RWA will contort the rules to exclude LGBT romance without appearing to be discriminating.

RWA&#039;s a dinosaur, and from observing the politics from the outside, it&#039;s having an internal tug-of-war among its members.  But since I have never yet seen any hint that a writer earned a bigger advance, better terms, or anything substantial from RWA membership, the whole organization looks more and more like a kaffeeklatsch than a business organization.  The exclusion of epublishing--yes, it&#039;s ripe for abuse--but let&#039;s not forget that about half of ALL new businesses fail within the first year or two, for the same reason e-pubs go under--is ignoring reality in favor of acting on what the RWA old guard wants to believe.

As our recent economic troubles vividly demonstrate, &#039;faith-based&#039; business decisions lead to disaster.  E-publishing isn&#039;t going to go away if RWA closes its eyes and hides under the blanket.  And POD publishers may well find themselves better able to ride out the current financial storms, since they have no need to maintain inventory or finance massive production runs.

Interesting times....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Antipathy is a good word&#8211;and a perfect description.</p>
<p>&#8220;only the author can decide if the dream of being published is sufficient reward to offset the fact that their royalties never break 2 digits. &#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll be the first to admit that I could probably make more money working a 40-hour job in an office somewhere, but my publisher and my book, Ransom, earned enough to qualify for RWA&#8217;s published status in the first year or so after my book was published.  </p>
<p>That was before RWA changed the rules to exclude POD.  And I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s a coincidence that the mass-production rule was put into effect immediately after some E-book publishers of GAY romance (mine among them) qualified for Professional status.</p>
<p>My being e-published led to a contract with Running Press for a mass-produced romance novel.  No agent or RWA involved.  I&#8217;m really curious to see how RWA will contort the rules to exclude LGBT romance without appearing to be discriminating.</p>
<p>RWA&#8217;s a dinosaur, and from observing the politics from the outside, it&#8217;s having an internal tug-of-war among its members.  But since I have never yet seen any hint that a writer earned a bigger advance, better terms, or anything substantial from RWA membership, the whole organization looks more and more like a kaffeeklatsch than a business organization.  The exclusion of epublishing&#8211;yes, it&#8217;s ripe for abuse&#8211;but let&#8217;s not forget that about half of ALL new businesses fail within the first year or two, for the same reason e-pubs go under&#8211;is ignoring reality in favor of acting on what the RWA old guard wants to believe.</p>
<p>As our recent economic troubles vividly demonstrate, &#8216;faith-based&#8217; business decisions lead to disaster.  E-publishing isn&#8217;t going to go away if RWA closes its eyes and hides under the blanket.  And POD publishers may well find themselves better able to ride out the current financial storms, since they have no need to maintain inventory or finance massive production runs.</p>
<p>Interesting times&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: RWA &#38; The Case of the Lack of Vision &#124; Dear Author: Romance Novel Reviews, Industry News, and Commentary</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2359</link>
		<dc:creator>RWA &#38; The Case of the Lack of Vision &#124; Dear Author: Romance Novel Reviews, Industry News, and Commentary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 00:22:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2359</guid>
		<description>[...] from her presidency expiring. What was the point? Several others responded however here, here and here. Deidre Knight responded with an eloquent and cogent argument on E-span, the electronic publishing [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] from her presidency expiring. What was the point? Several others responded however here, here and here. Deidre Knight responded with an eloquent and cogent argument on E-span, the electronic publishing [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Bree</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2355</link>
		<dc:creator>Bree</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 16:30:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2355</guid>
		<description>@Viv &lt;i&gt;While I agree working from within is best way to make an impact, at this time I feel like my time is better spent writing another story, than trying to be the new kid on the block that no one wants to play with.&lt;/i&gt;

Honestly, that&#039;s pretty much how I feel.  There are days when I want to jump on the Change Boat and fight, but seriously.  I can be alienated and condescended to without paying for the privilege.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Viv <i>While I agree working from within is best way to make an impact, at this time I feel like my time is better spent writing another story, than trying to be the new kid on the block that no one wants to play with.</i></p>
<p>Honestly, that&#8217;s pretty much how I feel.  There are days when I want to jump on the Change Boat and fight, but seriously.  I can be alienated and condescended to without paying for the privilege.</p>
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		<title>By: Leila Brown</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2354</link>
		<dc:creator>Leila Brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 16:30:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2354</guid>
		<description>Bree,
I totally agree with you. I have been a member of RWA since 2002. I have been a member through all the bricks life has thrown at me. I made the decision to submit to sell to an epub before I even considered print pubs. 

My reasoning was that even with the help RWA had given me I was still to green about the ears. Through epublishing I would learn and grow. And I have. I have grown and learned that NY advance paying publishers are not the only way to make my dreams come true.

As far as to RWA&#039;s treatment of it&#039;s epubbed members. All I can say is that when my membership expires in October of this year, they will have one less to kick around.

Leila Brown</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bree,<br />
I totally agree with you. I have been a member of RWA since 2002. I have been a member through all the bricks life has thrown at me. I made the decision to submit to sell to an epub before I even considered print pubs. </p>
<p>My reasoning was that even with the help RWA had given me I was still to green about the ears. Through epublishing I would learn and grow. And I have. I have grown and learned that NY advance paying publishers are not the only way to make my dreams come true.</p>
<p>As far as to RWA&#8217;s treatment of it&#8217;s epubbed members. All I can say is that when my membership expires in October of this year, they will have one less to kick around.</p>
<p>Leila Brown</p>
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		<title>By: Vivian Arend</title>
		<link>http://moirarogers.com/blog/archives/1016/comment-page-1#comment-2353</link>
		<dc:creator>Vivian Arend</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 15:50:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moirarogers.com/blog/?p=1016#comment-2353</guid>
		<description>Very articulate Bree, and I have to agree with your Very Important Point:

Quote:Well, Ms. Pershing, perhaps you should not base your illogical assumptions on the fact that members  you’ve spent the last year smacking with a verbal stick repeatedly in an attempt to drive away aren’t jumping through the hoops required to join the Club For Super Special People.:End quote

I&#039;m a totally newbie author. When my first month ebook sales made me eligible to join PAN, I looked into the RWA . Surprised by the controversy I discovered, I still asked around for reasons to join. The only feasible suggestion I heard, considering the attitude of the leadership, is if I&#039;m a member I can help to change the system from within.

While I agree  working from within is best way to make an impact, at this time I feel like my time is better spent writing another story, than trying to be the new kid on the block that no one wants to play with.

Viv</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very articulate Bree, and I have to agree with your Very Important Point:</p>
<p>Quote:Well, Ms. Pershing, perhaps you should not base your illogical assumptions on the fact that members  you’ve spent the last year smacking with a verbal stick repeatedly in an attempt to drive away aren’t jumping through the hoops required to join the Club For Super Special People.:End quote</p>
<p>I&#8217;m a totally newbie author. When my first month ebook sales made me eligible to join PAN, I looked into the RWA . Surprised by the controversy I discovered, I still asked around for reasons to join. The only feasible suggestion I heard, considering the attitude of the leadership, is if I&#8217;m a member I can help to change the system from within.</p>
<p>While I agree  working from within is best way to make an impact, at this time I feel like my time is better spent writing another story, than trying to be the new kid on the block that no one wants to play with.</p>
<p>Viv</p>
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